EPISODE 12: Jennifer Hollett
On this episode of Reinvention of the VJ , Erica Ehm gets up close and person with Jennifer Hollett about her evolution from MuchMusic VJ to becoming a thought leader in tech, media and politics.
While Jen’s time at Much was relatively short it was only one of the many stops on her journey towards politics, policy and now publishing. On today’s podcast, get ready to be inspired and challenged by this force for good on a mission to make the world a better place.
Show Transcript
Hi there. I'm Erica Ehm. And thank you so much for tuning into this episode of my reinvention of the vj podcast. My guest today. Well, she's a force of nature, who is powered by purpose. She's considered a leader in tech in media and politics. She's a savvy communicator who's doing her part to change the world. her time at muchmusic was actually relatively short. It was just one of the many stops on her journey towards politics, policy, and now publishing on today's podcast get ready to be inspired and challenged by this woman on a mission, Jennifer hollett. But before we jump into our interview, if this is your first time tuning into my podcast, just let me give you a bit of background. reinvention of the vj podcast is my up close and personal conversations with some of the eclectic and talented personalities you may have grown up with on muchmusic. Some I worked really closely with others like Jen, we're after my time. While our personalities and approaches were usually quite different. There's one thing that we all have in common. Each of us played a small part in Canada's most influential pop culture platform, much music, and then we left at different times and for different reasons. Each of us set off on our next adventures. And it's that story of what happens after much the reinvention, the resilience, the luck, the innovation, and perspective. That's what really intrigues me. So my chat with Jennifer, may be a trip down memory lane for you. But I'm also hoping that through our conversation, you find some interesting tidbits or insights into what it takes for you to get what you want in life. Maybe how you can reinvent or deal with tough times that are happening in your life. Or maybe it will help you redefine what success is for you. Listen, a lot of us are going through challenging times. And a lot of us are being forced to reevaluate our priorities and our choices in life. And maybe this conversation can inspire you in some small way to look at life with a new perspective. Which brings me to the powerhouse that is Jen hollett. Hey, Jen, welcome to the show. And thank you so much for taking time to be with me. I know your schedule is just nuts these days.
Unknown Speaker 3:10
Well, I'm happy to be here. And Eric, I've mentioned this to you before, but I grew up watching you. So this is very meta. And I know when I've said to you before, like, this is real, you're always like, Oh, stop it. So it's, it's interesting, because I've had people come up to me say, I grew up watching you and I'm like, Oh, cool. It's always kind of like this awkward, awkward thing. So I've always enjoyed the opportunities we've had together. And it's such a unique experience being a vj. So I'm just looking forward to chatting about it and really making sense of it. Because like once a VGA, always the VGA that that's what what my experience has been like, I'm still that DJ, even though I've done so many other things, I will always be known for being a DJ.
Unknown Speaker 3:50
I described you as a woman on a mission. Is that accurate? Jen,
Unknown Speaker 3:54
I like that like to me, to me, I take that as as a compliment. Because there's a sense of purpose. In that description there. There's urgency and it's why I got into the media. So when I was younger in high school, and this is pre social media pre email accounts, I had as an independent magazine that was basically me on my my typewriter, copy and paste, you know, friends who could draw friends could write articles. And I put together this scene and treated it with Xen stirs and pen pals all around the world. Because I believe that stories matter and, and that if you could shine the spotlight, you know, on on something that you think people only knew a bit more about that that had the power to change the world. So that's really what attracted me, especially to television. And it's why I love music, right? It was music. I started with pop music, and then got into punk got in hip hop got an indie rock and that's how I started learning about politics and the idea of what a better world could look like.
Unknown Speaker 4:56
You know, you mentioned that it that you really found a sense of Purpose by communicating with people etc. And there is a strong connection between purpose and happiness. Is that what sort of keeps? Because you, when you when I speak to you, you always sort of glow? And do you think that there is a connection between your happiness and the fact that you do have a purpose in life?
Unknown Speaker 5:21
I think so. I mean, the research definitely suggests that, and I know, I am happiness, when I'm doing things when I'm trying things when I have an idea, and I go for it. So I've, I've always been that, like, when I was a kid, you know, a greatest hit story, my family that's been told quite a few times, is I was, I was a girl scout. And you know, the other girl scouts are getting their badges like, you know, 1110 this group gets to this group. And it's like, I had nine or something. I mean, I just because it was like, what I can get badges by dancing and sewing. And in going out into the forest, this this sounds great. So for me, as long as I'm doing as long as I'm trying, that does make me happy. And I think it can be hard, right? Because there are there are times and even after much music there. There was definitely a time of like, what am I who am I? Where am I going next? And and the flip can happen where you just feel like oh, like that's not a good feeling. But but it's all part of the process on on trying right and getting getting closer to really, I think it is about the journey.
Unknown Speaker 6:27
I totally agree with that. And it's interesting how when I speak to you, you remind me a lot of Strongbow of George stroumboulopoulos, who was also on air around the same time as you Yeah. And he looks like a bad guy, you know, or a tough guy. But we both know that he is sort of a brilliant and thoughtful and very positive. And when we had our conversation, because you know, I'm speaking to all the other on air VJs as well. I asked him about his mom, because he was raised by a single mom. Boy, he just exploded with love about his mom. And he said that really He is the man he is today because of his single mom and the way she raised him. And then I find out that Hello, Jen, Holly was also raised by a single mom. And I thought, is there a similarity? There is? Are you that generous, purposeful, young person? Because of the way your mom raised you?
Unknown Speaker 7:34
Yeah, absolutely. So I think there's a few things there. One, I was raised in the Catholic Church. And while I'm not practicing, I was definitely raised to know care about your neighbor, and to really like give back to the community and the world. But I think specifically to the single mom part, when you're raised by a single mom, or single parent, for that matter, at a young age, you have extra responsibility, and you discover your agency, right? So you kind of have permission earlier to like, try things to do things to own things. And then also to like for our moms who who left bad marriages, you know, you see what it looks like, at a young young age to, to stand up for something right. And, and to make that difficult decision, especially for George and I, we grew up in a generation, there weren't as many single moms like I think now we have all types of modern families. But there were a lot of women in the earlier generations, you know, our, our mothers or grandmothers are great grandmother's generations who stayed in marriages because they didn't have the option to leave, especially economically. So yeah, there is something really strong and powerful to be a single mom, and the kids really, despite the challenges, the kids really benefit from that role modeling.
Unknown Speaker 8:46
You know, my, my mom wasn't a single mom. I mean, she eventually split with my dad, but I was older and well formed. However, my mom had a huge impact on my life. And as you're talking, I was thinking one of the things that she taught me was to never be afraid to ask for what you want in life. And I feel like that somehow is part of you in some degree. I feel like you are fearless. Again, I'm projecting. But how true is that for you?
Unknown Speaker 9:19
Yeah, you're very observant. And, you know, for me, both my parents always encouraged me. You know, they any idea I had, they were like, Yeah, go for it. Right. I always felt that I just go out into the world and try something and do something. And I had the support of both of them. And it was only until I late I like later met more people realize that like a lot of people kids and then adults don't have that from their parents. Their parents are really trying to say, like, success looks like this or you should do this or should do those pressures. I mean, I'll give you an example. I am 45 years old. I'm a single woman, no kids. I have Have a zero pressure from my dad or mom to get married to have kids like, this is me, this is my life. I'm enjoying it. I'm happy. I would say most women who are 45, you know, single without kids, they are still feeling that pressure from from family. And if not their parents, everyone else, you know, around them asking questions. So I really benefited from just having that unconditional love and support. So then I'm not really operating from fear, because it's also okay if I try something and it doesn't work out, right. And it allows me to dream really big. But also, if I feel really big, that that's all part of it. So I'm really fortunate and thankful to have that support. Vote Come
Unknown Speaker 10:42
on, but that's easy to say, to dream really big and fail really big. And you're okay with it. When you're in that moment, when there are those big failures. Are you okay with it?
Unknown Speaker 10:55
Well, yes and no, like, so it's funny. I was talking to a friend about this. And she was like, Oh, come on, Jen. Like, when have you failed, I'm like, Well, I ran for office, and like, people got to, you know, make a checkmark next to my name. I didn't get enough votes like that. That's an official failure. And she said to me, like, Oh, my God, I don't see that as a failure at all. And I said, thanks. But like, it is a by the book failure. When you go out and you say, vote for me, and not enough people vote for you like that, that is a failure, you have lost, right and your party has has lost. So it kind of comes back to like how we even like, look at winning and losing, because it is in the eye of the beholder. And I know for me, when you know, I look at Stacey Abrams, or Hillary Clinton, or people I voted for here in Canada who have maybe lost, I don't see them as losers at all. And I think that extends to all types of failure, right? where, you know, think about the people who have a business idea and and launch it. And ultimately, it only lasts for a year or maybe five years or declare bankruptcy. Like for me, I'm like, that's not a failure. Like you tried something, it didn't work, but like you went after it, and you've learned a lot, and I think you're a better stronger person. But of course, like the day after the 2015 election, like I remember, I went into a Tim Hortons just getting timbits you know, and it's classic, because the same thing would happen. And when I was at much like, I did not want to be seen. Of course someone comes up and is like, Hi, are you Jennifer Khalid and thanks for and it's just like, oh, Mike, like, I don't I'm not in the mood for anything.
Unknown Speaker 12:27
Wait, you said they were gonna say thanks for something. Like,
Unknown Speaker 12:30
yeah, thanks for running. Like, they haven't like a very positive thing. Like, like, thanks for running. Like, I'm so glad. And I just don't want to hear any of it. Like, leave me alone. I want to be in the fetal position for a week, please. You know, so. So yeah, that is the truth of it is even when someone says thanks, it doesn't feel there's still that horrible Park, the opposite of my positivity. I of course have those moments.
Unknown Speaker 12:54
So if we want to dive into that era, you lost when you ran against chrystia Freeland now. Come on. She's now the, you know, almost the Prime Minister. She's incredibly powerful in our government today. So does knowing that she has gone so high up in in the government. Does it change your perspective of that time when you ran for office against such a powerful woman?
Unknown Speaker 13:24
Yeah, no, because I see myself that way. Right. So for me, it was really exciting to be running against Christine and the other candidates. And actually, during the election, which was quite a long election by Canadian standards, right? So Stephen Harper, and the conservatives who designed it. So it was three and a half months, because they thought that would work to their advantage. It actually didn't in the end, and then all the polls for university Rosedale where I ran, I was actually positioned to win, right. So there was a long point of that election if your call to the NDP was going to form government. But ultimately, the liberals had a wave, right. And they won. And, you know, they ran, they ran the strongest campaign. So, like, for me, I'm very happy for chrystia and it has been exciting to watch her success and all of her different portfolios, she has great influence. But it could have been me. Right? It could have been me. So that's the part of politics that that you have to kind of, like, at the end of the soccer game, like good game, good game, good game. And, and, and really just say, like, you know, well done. And, you know, but it could have been, it could have been me. So there were a lot of people who said at the doors like, Oh, it's such a shame that I have to choose between, you know, two strong, bold, successful progressive women. I'm like, No, this is great. This is how we want it. Like we want so many women running to get different parties that you have to choose. Like, like to me that was that was not a bad thing like that. That's actually progress.
Unknown Speaker 14:52
When I hear you talk you speak from as a woman who has had so much experience in life So much where you've been in really interesting positions, and I want to go back now before muchmusic, you were working at Sony Music, I believe that you were hired to do some digital strategy for them and sort of bring them into the future. That was a time and you can correct me if I'm wrong, but that was a time when the music industry was in, was still in denial that their business model was impeccable that streaming and Pandora would not bring the industry down. So how I'm guessing that you were probably somewhat radical in your suggestions for them to evolve. What was that time like for you working in the music industry that was collapsing around you?
Unknown Speaker 15:46
Yeah, I
Unknown Speaker 15:46
mean, what a gift right? What a gift in so many ways. So I did my Bachelor of Arts at Concordia University, and I did a specialization in journalism communications. That was me see, oh, by the way, when I volunteered at cable 10 back in the day in high school, someone was like, I think Erica Ehm Azim capleton experience. I did. Yeah, I did. I
Unknown Speaker 16:09
hosted a show. That's so crazy. Find all these similarities as we as we go along, for sure. Anyway, go back to your story that Sony,
Unknown Speaker 16:18
say I think sometimes people think v J's come out of nowhere where we actually had been doing the work for, you know, for a while, maybe not at the same level. But so when I was at university, and this was the mid 90s, that's where I got an email address. And this was a time where the email like it was very basic, really just like academics and computer nerds. By the time I graduated University, Netscape was introducing graphics to the internet, right. So I was offered this job at Sony Music and what they called their new media team. It had been called consumer technology before that. And it was because I was working with Sony as a college marketing Rep. And they were growing their team. So here I come in 1997 working on artists, websites, you know, doing content and then later marketing for Celine Dion, Glenn Gould, Leonard Cohen, Our Lady peace, like what what a dream job right? But even though I was in the music industry, at a time when like you said, Pandora, streaming real remember real player like you could watch like, Whoa, a concert, it would be all pixelated, but you can watch like, part of a concert, you know, on online, the Napster pops up. So despite, like all of this, still, people didn't understand what we were doing. It's like, what do you say people?
Unknown Speaker 17:39
You mean, industry executives, or
Unknown Speaker 17:41
I would say everyone, so definitely within the industry, what we were doing was very new, and often the traditional industry, and that would be all the different teams like sales, marketing, even the artists themselves management didn't quite get what we were doing. So that was kind of a lot of fun. Because we had trust, right? Like we kind of just do it. Some of the newer artists got it because they saw like, Oh, this is working right. Like like this. This is this is where our fans are coming from. But even I would say outside, like, I think when people heard I worked in the music industry, they thought I was an a&r and consign artists, like I don't think people realize like, Oh, it's digital. And that's growing. So having a front row seat and seeing an industry that at the time had money I mean, money bags, you know, you were you were there you were in the industry, like it was it was a time of like, great celebration, all the stereotypes were true like that, that stereotype of the rock star or the rock star, that was all true. And then it changed, right? Because the business model change. What was unique about being at Sony, is when you think about it, Sony had the Walkman, Sony had the Discman. So Sony should have had the mp3 player. But not only was there Sony electronics, but there was Sony Music in the same company, right? So this is where the missed opportunity for Sony is, instead of our iPods and then later iPhones, it could have been within Sony but there was just so much tension and and the labels weren't on the same page together.
Unknown Speaker 19:12
So you left. And where is that connection between muchmusic was there a connection between our job at Sony and landing it much.
Unknown Speaker 19:22
What had happened was I was having a great time and doing very well at Sony Music. And I had met a TV producer, who had been introduced to me because we were doing a website for MC Mario who's like a really big DJ, especially with the presence and profile in Montreal. And I guess he took my card and put it in a folder of like, who knows maybe one day like someone we can work with. And so someone reached out to me who said like oh, Mark, Mark passed on on on your name. We're auditioning for a new TV show. It's ctvs new digital channel, talk TV. It's called the chat room and watch Because I have been auditioning, like, that's what I went to school for. And you do a lot of auditions before you get a gig. So I thought, okay, like, I'm really happy where I am. But let's audition. So I'm
Unknown Speaker 20:10
going to interrupt for a second. You know what, not everybody has to audition. There's the Amanda Walsh story.
Unknown Speaker 20:15
Oh, it's true. Yeah, at counter,
Unknown Speaker 20:18
you know, a little restaurant in the city that I grew up in, and they said, come and do much music, which you know, rarely happens.
Unknown Speaker 20:27
Or enough. It's true. You always are the DJ who's someone in the mall. And we like those stories, right? Because it feels like you haven't anyone. Where's Yeah, I went the traditional route I audition. And, you know, I worked at the chat room as a host. And it really just felt like this dream come come true. And at the time, I was working with Seamus O'Regan, right, who would go on to Canada. And you know, now politics working with Ben Mulroney. So it's also interesting to see the early days of these careers. So then when I was at CTV, I had and this is this is talk about just like living life and how things line a producer I had met at CTV, I bumped into them on Maid of the Mist in Niagara Falls, Maid of the Mist
Unknown Speaker 21:11
that's random.
Unknown Speaker 21:13
I had a friend in from Germany, we're like, you gotta go to Maid of the Mist. And he's like, yo, like, I'm over on muchmusic. Now we like, like, we should catch up. So, you know, we grab lunch, and he's like, we're dishing DJs, you should apply. And I thought, like, I have a job. I'm happy. I'm not looking. And then I thought, who am I to turn down a job I don't have like, I should audition. Like, why not? I love much music. I was still watching much music wasn't even I grew up. It was like, I was always watching much music, and then auditioning and going through three rounds. I realized, Oh, I really want this this job. And I was hired as a DJ and videographer alongside Hannah son, we got hired at the same time. And then we go on to become very good friends. She's one of my closest friends. So so it's like, again, you meet people along the way, right? who say let's let's talk. So those connections were really key in my career.
Unknown Speaker 22:04
So I described your time at muchmusic is sort of like much 2.0. In a way, almost a completely different much music from when I was there. You were there, like a decade after I was pretty much right. So you had the I don't know the the experience of watching. Well, you mentioned me and the other people on muchmusic. And so you kind of got a sense of what much is all about. And when, when you were going to walk into sort of my shoes, so to speak. What did you feel you could bring that was different that much didn't have yet?
Unknown Speaker 22:41
This is a really funny question. Because it's something I thought a lot about when I was working at Sony Music, one of the best perks of the job is much music was on all the time. So not only did I get to work in the music industry, in New Media at a time when it was exploding, like, like artists were always walking around, they were concerts in the muchmusic screen was right about above my desk, so watch much music a lot, like not just after school. You know, I watched it a lot. And one of the things I thought I could bring with my background in new media was it wasn't called social media at the time, but I thought I could like just really connect with people, I thought, I'm going to be the DJ who's going to be in the message boards. I'm going to be the DJ with my own website and my own message board. And I'm gonna I'm connecting I'm gonna make myself available and accessible to the viewers, and did that on much on demand. I was always in chat. And I wanted to make sure that like I was in chat, like not a producer was in chat, right? Like, not someone pretending to me, but like me, it's because that's the part I always loved about much is because it's really changed right now. Right? Like you go by Queen and john. And there is no much music is there is they boarded up the window. Right? There's like, like black curtain you can't even look in. But in the heyday, you could look in you could see a BGA going across the street, right? You could be part of a live show, you could stumble by and be like, I'm in the muchmusic Video Awards somehow, like, I didn't even realize what's happening. And now I'm gonna go be in it right. Like, there's just always a way to touch it. So I was really hoping to be able to do that online, right is take that idea of the environment and extend it. So I did do that. But there were a lot of challenges. I was not ready for the hate that that's the part I was I was not ready for was all the hate and abuse.
Unknown Speaker 24:25
There was hate back then.
Unknown Speaker 24:27
Yeah. And like this is the part. So again, you know, just to give everyone the context, I was a vj between 2002 in 2005. Right. So there's no Twitter, there's no Facebook. We didn't even have MySpace yet. Right? It was just message boards and emails. And I would go into the message boards I had the message boards were very active It was a type of social media back then. And I would go in and you know, say hi and answer questions and see what across and and people would comment on my looks all the time. I had lots of different funky haircuts. And there were people were just obsessed with what they said how ugly I was. And they would always, like, always, always comment on this. And it's like, Okay, why am I spending my time? Right? Like, why am I spending my time in these spaces when people are just spewing hate and extended actually beyond the computer screen? I remember one day I had left the building, and I heard someone mumble something. And I was in a really feisty mood. And I said, say to my face, and he said to my face, you're fucking ugly. And that surprised me. Right? I was like, oh, wow, you said it to my face. And this happened a lot. Like it happened. Once I was walking with Devin Soltan D, same thing. Someone came up and said that to me again. And he was so kind he turned to me was like, first of all, it's not true. He's like, first of all, it's not true. And like, Are you okay, another time I was walking with Devin and Kensington Market, people were throwing beer bottle caps at us. Like they were up on a they were threatened. I said, I just turned him I said, run. So there was like a lot of and what I found is for the women, it's the beauty myth, right? So it's like, how can I hurt her? And it would be like, You're ugly. Whereas the men that you're always told they were gay, it was a very homophobic time, right. And that seemed to be the big insult of the moment, which is like, first of all they are Who cares? But it was just like, like, so that that was a part I wasn't, I wasn't ready for I didn't realize like, how much heat there is. And maybe it's baked in jealousy, like, maybe it's baked in, in self hate, but it was hard to receive.
Unknown Speaker 26:23
I received a fair amount I was told I was ugly all the time, my nose was too big. I considered getting a nose job. And then I realized, wait a second, I was hired because I look like this and screw them. This is how I look. And I have the job. And you're all suckers and see you later. So I just it really taught me or forced me to, to dig down deep and grow backbone, and stand up to bullies. But I didn't get it to that degree. And that's interesting. That's a 10 year gap, if you will. I also think it's interesting because when people would talk about our asked me questions about my time at muchmusic, I often said that I felt like it was the precursor to social media. And what I mean about that was Moses had this vision of sort of democratizing the media. First of all, each of the on air, people were told that we're no more important than our audience. And I don't know if that was still consistent with the messaging that
Unknown Speaker 27:25
you got, but we will I mean, our desks, like think about it, there were no often things like, our tests are like, oh, someone's sitting on my desk doing an interview. Oh, there's the audience coming, walking around me while I'm trying to research, right? Like we were one. And the audience was brought
Unknown Speaker 27:39
into shows people were invited to walk through all the time, we would take requests all the time, there was speaker's corner, which became part of the programming. So for me, I really felt like looking back with perspective, that much music believed in the importance of community, and of not being autocratic, but being sort of having engagement and using the technologies at the time, which were like fax machines, and answering machines. And, you know, it was a different way of doing it. So I think it's interesting, though, but we did not experience hate like that in by time. And so what was going on? Do you think, in the culture that would create that kind of? I don't even know what the word is that, that belief that you can say those hateful things to someone's face. Cuz when I was younger, no one ever did that to me. I could hear little whispers behind me, but they would never say it to me. Well, that
Unknown Speaker 28:44
was surprised me when I was like face on it because I thought like, he might just go Oh, hi. But then we I am Canadian, right? Like,
Unknown Speaker 28:51
because Canadians were not hateful, hateful. I didn't think
Unknown Speaker 28:54
yeah, it's funny. It even happened to me once because so this is the part I think a lot of people don't understand is because of that. Democracy. Right in at muchmusic. In chum. Like, I took the TTC that's how I got to work, right. It's like, like, I'm out and about, I'm just a regular person who's being asked to sign autographs. Right. So if it's like, and sometimes, you know, during the heyday of much sometimes the VGA is the bigger celeb than the artists like sometimes you might even ever never even heard of this, this artists, right? It's, it's the vj that people watch for. I remember taking the TTC. And there were two people in front of me two young guys. And they were talking about much music deliberately knowing I was there. And I was like, like, at what? So at one point, I was like, Hi, I'm here. I can hear you. Like it's this weird. I think there's a few things. So with the vj search, which again is part of this democratization of like anyone can be a vj and I do think that much more So much now or even after my time, but sure we were cool, but like we're only a little bit more cool than the audience right? Like, like I didn't have a stylist Yes, we had a makeup artist, which was great. But I felt like I bought my clothes at Value Village and like Yeah, I definitely got lots of free swag, you know it and stuff. But like it was still us like it was still us kind of like putting together and kind of doing our doing our own thing. And that was the appeal. So because of the vj search, and I often as videographer would go to the malls and you know, be on stage hyping up the auditions for the vj search and I read a story. So everyone felt they could be a vj, right like that. And that's what we were selling. Everyone could be a vj. So I think people felt like, I could do your job and better than you. So I'm going to put you down. I do think I do think that that's part of it. I even had one woman say to me, you got my job. And I said, I said, Well, what sorry. She's like, we've got my job. And it's like, no, I got the job. Like, it's not my job. But So the good news is everyone felt they were muchmusic. But maybe On the flip side, is when you felt like that job should be yours or your friends, then what you're going to do is cut the people up who have the job, like perhaps and then there's also just massage Annie, right, the hatred for women. And I think I think it's a mix. All to say though this existed pre Twitter, right? This existed pre pre Facebook, for those of us who dared to go into the spaces. And it's, I think what was frustrating for me is I'm like, there are lots of people on this message board or in the streets. We're not talking to me like this. So I also have to keep being me and being accessible because the majority, right, the majority of it actually was positive. But, boy, when the harassment was there, it was vile.
Unknown Speaker 31:57
So I see you as a lifelong learner, I see that you are constantly putting yourself in challenging roles so that you can learn new things. What did you learn much that you couldn't have learned in any school?
Unknown Speaker 32:14
A lot, like a lot. I learned a lot much I think, like one of the like unique, really incredible things about doing so much live TV. And I also did a lot of live TV talk to me when we were four and a half hours live tonight. Most TV is not live, most TV is pre taped and packaged. And it looks so good. Because a lot of work goes into it. Live TV is the opposite. Right? It's very much in the moment. So you get comfortable with just the unexpected, right? And I remember, there were always tours going on, right always classrooms coming through always people coming through the building. And one thing people would often say on the tour that that we would pair it and say as well is welcome to the much environment where like anything can happen and usually does. And that was true. So to work in an environment where anything can happen and usually does you get used to it, right? So you're very comfortable with things going wrong and being able to adapt, you get comfortable and remember, no, especially with much on demand, we'd be a half an hour away from from like going live at five o'clock. And it would be like, just confirm, we got the rights to this artist and you're going to be interviewing, like insert a listener of the moment and you're like, what, so yeah, we were like, what, like in a half an hour. I'm interviewing who like Sean Paul, okay, like sure. But like, it's not that like you have one week you so you just had to you had to be ready to you had to be ready to dance. So just learning like, okay, let's dance. Like let's get into it. I'm curious, though, Erica, for you. Like what what was your takeaway from like, what, what the School of much music taught you? Well, it
Unknown Speaker 33:53
taught me to be sort of a jack of all trades, because we didn't really have producers, at least in my day. So there, we didn't have scripts. So I learned how to not write a script, but I would. I've learned how to tell a story on the fly. I learned how to do research, I learned how to interview. I learned how to get dressed, you know, present myself publicly. I learned to edit myself so that I would not ever insult people live, you know, because sometimes when you're speaking, live for hours, and you're really relaxed and casual being on TV, you have to be careful because as part of the comedy or the humors some of us put people down. So I learned to be very sort of aware of the effect of my words on other people. It also reminded me about the importance of being a role model. I mean, it was very evident from the the unending number of emails and letters that I received from Girls, some of them who were really jealous of me, as you mentioned, but ultimately, they wanted to be me. So I needed it was important to me to be a really good version of me. So hopefully people would Aspire. girls would aspire to be strong, comfortable in their sensuality. I wouldn't say sexuality, but sensuality, comfortable being the smart girl in the room, which is to me, that to me is feminism being the smart girl in the room and yet comfortable with being attractive, etc. that was, that was really important to me. And thank you for that question.
Unknown Speaker 35:42
During the interviews here,
Unknown Speaker 35:47
things that when you're at muchmusic, it's such a full on job. So the hardest part of the job because it is a dream gig, right? Like it, it was the best of times, it was the worst of times, like it is everything. And what I mean by that is, the hardest part of the job is that you're always a muchmusic vj, right. So it's a fun job. You know, and it's challenging, and all the best ways. And yet, you get to go to concerts and you know, hang out with celebrities like all that all that. And you get to do a job. That's fun, right? Like, that's cool. You know, that's interesting. That's in the moment. But then you're always working. But you can't even just go to a concert and enjoy.
Unknown Speaker 36:26
Yeah, but that's part of the The reason I think, well, at least what why I was hired and many other people were hired is because that was what we lived on a daily basis. So going to concerts and talking about music and interviewing bands, was what we wanted to do, I would do it and not even been paid to do it. And I think that's, that is most of us, although we did get paid, etc. Although I did get paid less than the men By the way, then, I think that was certainly what brought a lot of us what was appealing to a lot of us about the job. One thing that I wanted to ask you was about I know jack Layton was, or interviewing jack Layton was a moment for you that you were invited to interview him on muchmusic. And it introduced to you the future of politics. And that's sort of an old story, Jennifer, like if you know, gentlemen, you know that story about jack Layton. But the story that I want to know is the other artists or musicians or personalities who came into much music that had a huge effect on Jen today, who else was really powerful or meaningful to you?
Unknown Speaker 37:44
Yeah, I have to say it's such a pleasure being interviewed by you, your questions are just so so thoughtful and well researched. And and it's funny, it's just a reminder of like the art right? The the art of being a vj, it's my
Unknown Speaker 37:57
favorite thing, of not the art of being a vj, but the art of interviewing. And I know that that has been a part of your life through you know, it served as well in many different capacities. But thanks for that. And what's the answer? What's the answer? Done?
Unknown Speaker 38:11
No. The one of the ones that comes to mind is interviewing pink. So when I interviewed pink, it was my first live it much and that's like a really big special because compared to the live TV, you and I were just talking about well live it much is live, it's bigger production, right, they bring in more money, there's performances, there's interview, it's, it's a bit tighter, right and, and has big reach. And the live it matches are done with the top artists. So pink, always been a fan. Also, like at the time, like we have very similar vibes and images, which is like short, funky hair. Definitely not traditional, like feminine looks. And pinks, always kind of known to like speak her mind and just put herself out there. And that's definitely know my approach. And it was just such a great interview, I think for both of us. And that's a bonus when that happens, right? Because you can do a great interview and the artist does not like it. Like some of the best interviews the artists not happy. It's like Well, too bad. My job is not to make you happy. It's great interview. But it was this this interview where I think we just connected and we were able to be in conversation in a way that drew the audience closer to to pink and her music. And then I went to see her her show later. And it was funny, because on stage she's like, Did anyone see the interview on muchmusic? And yeah, like it was it was definitely so that was a real highlight for me. The other one was interviewing the Beastie Boys. So for me growing up they were one of my favorites like one of my my favorite hip hop acts and they had a political awakening when you think back to the early Beastie Boys, right and then going on to the Tibetan freedom concerts and just becoming more socially aware and how that was reflected in their music that always give me a A lot of hope, and I got to interview them at their studio. And I just felt like, Oh my god, I'm using a washroom that they use, like, I just wasn't a total like ridiculous fan moment of like, when is security going to remove me? Like, when are they going to? And what's so cool is like not only like, did we do this like great 30 minute interview and for folks who know the Beastie Boys, they're actually a very difficult interview because they're, they're known to always joke and be sarcastic and play pranks like you rarely can can catch them in a sincere moment. But I had met ad rock at a show of one of his side projects, and given him basically my card for my baby girl crew by breakdance crew shebang. And he had passed it on to his partner Kathleen Hanna of Latika. So we had a bit of a connection and I was able to just off the top remind him like, hey, do you remember? So he was like off the top like, Oh, yeah, cool and kind of like said to the guys like, Oh, yeah, like, like, like, she's really cool. So it was great. And you know, that interview especially because, you know, now the Beastie Boys are no longer like, you know, with with without them having passed. It's just like, I think, an interview that stands the test of time for them and their body of work. And then for me as a fan. I mean, we are fans of music. At the end of the day, every DJ was hired because they do live it right. So you have those moments where you're just like, I'm gonna be cool in the bathroom. Have a little scream. Okay, we're cool. Let's go to the interview.
Unknown Speaker 41:31
What did you say you have a breakdown, you had a breakdown?
Unknown Speaker 41:35
Yeah, so while at much, I was a founding member of shibang, and we'd started in 99. But it was an all girl breakdance crew. And it like really exploded as I was heading into much. So like, on top of like the full time job of being a DJ. We were dancing with Nelly Furtado, Beastie Boys actually ended up inviting us to come on tour with them in Toronto and Ottawa, we were battling all over North America. So it was spirit. And actually, in my interview, like with with the executives at the end, is I said, like, Listen, if you're looking for someone who lives it, like, this is what this is my life. This is this is this is what I do. Like I love music and all the community and culture around it. So but I think what was a time a bit tricky to navigate is B girls and B boys is actually a very like underground community and subculture. So I think at first people were kind of like, you know, like, she is sellout what she tried to do, I ended up hosting some battles on much where we were able to, like highlight and spotlight the talents of B boys and B girls across the country. And there were prizes. So I think when people saw like, No, no, no, like, Don't worry, we're gonna connect this. That was a great thing to be able to do. I had no
Unknown Speaker 42:54
idea that is so very cool. We were talking about the art of interviewing, give me a few tips. How do you do a good interview? What makes a good interview?
Unknown Speaker 43:04
Listening? And it's the hardest part. I know, it sounds so obvious. But if we're all being honest with ourselves, often we're pretending to listen. And we're just thinking about the thing that we want to say. Also, when you do so much research and to your point, Erica VJs did do even when we had producers, still the majority of the of the research, you want to take all your cards and answer it, you know, you get answers all the questions you pre wrote. But sometimes the best thing to do is throw them all out the window and just have faith that you've done the research and listen to what the artist is saying, or the subject is saying and go with them. So you have to be really well researched. But you have to listen and be willing to say I'm listening and I'm hearing I shouldn't stick with my order. I need to be in the moment.
Unknown Speaker 43:47
Yeah, you messed up this interview for me, that's for sure. I had a whole bunch of questions and you just danced around and like messed it all up. But the reality is you left much why.
Unknown Speaker 43:59
So I felt I had outgrown, much like I felt it was like I had a good run. Also a lot was changing, right? So I was at a time when I came in at much. It was still about the music. And by the end around 2005. It was more about celebrity culture, gossip, reality shows, I love that stuff as well. But there was a lot of change happening within pop culture and much. And after three and a half years, I felt like again, it was just kind of like I was ready to move on because there was a world for me to see. That's how I kind of kind of felt and that was really thanks too much. I mean, another key assignment for me was the first year I came on, I got to do a documentary in Afghanistan on youth and women. This is like post September 11. So that really kind of just opened my eyes to so many issues. And that's what I ultimately left much to do, which is To go and travel and volunteer in East Africa, and did that with care, which is a connection, because the documentary about Afghanistan was done in partnership with care Canada, well, that's
Unknown Speaker 45:09
a different life. Holy
Unknown Speaker 45:10
smokes,
Unknown Speaker 45:11
you gave up the celebrity, you gave up the perks, you gave up the music and you went and just went to work and became sort of an I'm going to use this term very, very loosely. But you became just another person behind the scenes, making the world potentially a better place.
Unknown Speaker 45:34
Yeah, it that felt very freeing, I will say like to be able to, like actually go to a part of the world where no one knew who I was as much music vj what's funny is I still bumped into Canadians, like I would be in no Kenya. And you know, and, and I was still meet a Canadian, and then they'd be like, are you and that's where I was like,
Unknown Speaker 45:54
Oh my god, I
Unknown Speaker 45:55
can like, I cannot escape this. Which which is funny. I mean, I remember even we were covering the tsunami. It was me and Gord martineau and Steve, one of the camera guys, and we were in Sri Lanka. And someone came up and went city TV everywhere.
Unknown Speaker 46:12
were amazing, like.
Unknown Speaker 46:18
So, but but it did, it did feel like freeing and I have another memory. Hannah sung and I a couple years after we left muchmusic we were in New York City together, and we were in the washroom. And it's common in women's washroom that women talk, right, like while you're in the washroom, so we're both in our stalls. And I said, Well, we can just talk out loud and no one cares what we're talking about. Like, no one's listening. Because they've clocked two we are like, Well, here we are just talking in the washroom.
Unknown Speaker 46:48
Oh, I thought you're gonna say and then somebody said, Hey, Jen, Khalid,
Unknown Speaker 46:53
you had a moment where we could just like yourself.
Unknown Speaker 46:57
So Jen, you then went back to school, you and not just school, you went to Harvard. So first of all, that's really expensive. So explain to me, when you decided you were going to go? How did you do it? Because there's a ton of preparation involved in doing something like that. Tell me about that experience. Yeah,
Unknown Speaker 47:21
sure. So as I became more and more interested in politics and policy and impossibly running for office, I had been working as a freelancer, I was at CBC, I thought, Hmm, maybe going back to school would be a good way to, to learn more. And to see if this is the direction I want to go with how old were you at the time, when you decided wouldn't have been? Yeah, I would have been mid 30s. And I thought, if I'm going to do it, let's do it. Like, like, if I'm going to go and get a mat, like if I'm going to take a year out of my life as what's called a mid career student, like, let's do it, let's go big. And I actually didn't want anyone to tell me that they didn't think I could get into Harvard. So only my mom and sister knew, like I just was quietly, you know, studying and taking the GRP working on my application. And in terms of the cost, because it's a huge cost us schools are so much more expensive than Canadian schools. I'm a saver. And that was basically my mortgage. You know, I rented I didn't have a car, like, that's where I wanted to spend my money and savings from from my career was to put it into my education, and in hopes that it would come back and like future career opportunities and pay, but also just like, this is my life. This is what I want to do. And what a great investment like going back to school. Now, what was very exciting about going to Harvard is aside from like, obviously, it's Harvard. Right? And I
Unknown Speaker 48:47
just think what was very exciting about going to Harvard. Did you just say you went to Harvard? Well, very cool.
Unknown Speaker 48:55
They call that the H bomb, right? So is that people from all over the world, right? With just such like incredible backstories. And accomplishments are also drawn to Harvard, but especially the Harvard Kennedy School. So when people would find out because again, there were Canadians there, right. So when word got out that I was like an MTV vj. That's how word got out. People loved it. Now I submitted a paper that drew from my experience in my babygirl crew, and the prof like, held it up and talked about it in front of the class. Right.
Unknown Speaker 49:28
So you were you there like you actually were in person? You went to Harvard in person? Yeah.
Unknown Speaker 49:33
Yeah. Yeah, no. Yeah. So So I found because at first I was a little shy about some, like my pop culture background. I didn't know that would be valued. People loved it. They got it, right. They saw it as a huge asset to the class.
Unknown Speaker 49:49
So an interesting thing that you talk about much music defining you and pop culture being a little bit embarrassing as us your career kind of evolved. Interesting in 2013, so that's eight years after you left much music after you had gone to Harvard after you'd worked at CBC, etc, etc. The headline in the Globe and Mail was former vj, Jennifer, Khalid Sikhs, federal NDP nomination. I mean, tell me about the baggage that you have had to carry? Because of those three years on muchmusic.
Unknown Speaker 50:34
Yeah, it's so funny. In this COVID year, I formed a neighborhood pod, basically, in my condo, people who could help out any one who needed groceries or like no medication from the pharmacy. And I was mentioned in an article It was like, even for muchmusic vj Jennifer Hall, it is done like a community pod. And like, I just laughed, because it's like
Unknown Speaker 51:00
20 years ago,
Unknown Speaker 51:02
so so it's both good and bad. So So the good news is, I loved much music, right? Like, so when it's all positive thoughts of like, like, much music, you know, is but especially was like such a big institution for youth culture, pop culture, arts, music, right? Like, it really defines the Canadian experience, like, so. Yeah. Like, say it like, it is a big deal. Like, wow, that's so cool. But on the flip side, unfortunately, I have found that people in society at large, don't value music and culture, like you and I, and people who watch much music. Do right. So I remember people would say to me, like, like, oh, like, you know, you'd be at a party or something. Oh, what do you do? Like, and I would go so broad, like, Oh, I work in the media. Oh, like, Where are the media? Oh, I work in TV. Oh, where do you want to be? You know, oh, I work at muchmusic? Yeah, I don't watch much music. Okay, you know, take a sip of my drink. And I'd say yeah, like, you're a little out of our demographic anyways, that's okay. There's something about pop culture that people just want to cut down. Where to meet. It's like, I, I can't imagine navigating COVID without use it to escape into right, without art to give me a path out of this right? Without creativity, right to make sense of like, What on earth? But so so it, I guess it depends when someone's saying, for you or me like, Oh, it's the vj, it could actually be a compliment in the way that they're saying it. Or it could be in this way of like, Oh, this is so it's so it's hard to say. And I think that's the tension, all of us will navigate for the rest of our lives.
Unknown Speaker 52:51
I have a listener question. This is from dawn in kaladin. And she asks, which job is more welcoming to women? And why politics? Or much music?
Unknown Speaker 53:05
So I have a big smile, because it's such a great question, in contrast, and I would say I think it's about the same actually. Because both jobs require you to be a public figure. And it's very hard to be a public figure in general, I think for everyone, but especially when you take that intersectionality of gender and race, LGBTQ, and you know, other factors. So like the actual job of itself, right? While there was definitely sexism in the music industry, and there's sexism and politics, I found the hardest part about the Jobs was the public part of it. Right. And, and people again, when you're a DJ, people are like, well, I could do your job. So let me tell you about this. You should play this video. You don't do enough this, this that I don't like this, don't like your hair, don't like your face. Whereas when you're a politician, and your job is to knock on doors and talk to people, people are also going to go Yeah, I don't like this. You should do this. Like Like, and actually that that is why you knock on doors. This for people. Let me tell you something, and like you
Unknown Speaker 54:11
learn for you to listen. Yeah,
Unknown Speaker 54:13
yeah. So I think very similar. The difference is we do see more women, still white women, but more women and more diversity on air and television, there's definitely been progress. There's more more work there. And less so in politics, politics, and politicians should represent their constituents. Right. Like, we should look to the House of Commons. We should, you know, look to provincial governments to local governments to say like, this is who we are, and we're not there yet. So big structural barriers remain in both industries. But But I think more work I would say right now in government and also because of its of its role by its nature.
Unknown Speaker 54:55
You are unstoppable and asked You lost, you failed. When you ran against chrystia Freeland, you said, I'm going to do it again. And you ran for municipal city councilor. And you were doing, you know, you were doing great. We were all rooting for you. And then Doug Ford stepped in and said, you know, you know what, there's too many city councilors, I'm going to cut the number down, and you were s o L. Now, the most, I think devastating part of that, for me was that you had given up a job at Twitter, where you were head of governance and news. I mean, that was an incredible job. So tell me about that time for you. Because I know, it was not a good time.
Unknown Speaker 55:45
It was horrible. It was really horrible. Because it's not an easy decision to run for office for anyone. But especially when you have a job that you like, but there's this like unique opportunity to run politics is all about timing. And the unique opportunity is Toronto was a growing city. So they were actually new wards. And this was after five years of consultation with the community, they were new wards to represent the population growth. And I had asked Twitter, if I could take a leave of absence. But it wasn't something they were able to grant me. So I just had to make this decision. Like I had to go all in or not. And I decided to go all in, because I saw a path there was there was a path there. Never thinking that the premier that the provincial government in the middle of an election that was already underway, would interfere in slash cancel and half. Now I am part of a legal challenge that it's on its way to the Supreme Court so that that fight continues and instead of principle at this, this point right now, but I think what was like so hard for me was I took this jump. And then like I landed on cement, like it was like, Oh, God, and you know, as someone who is seeing is like bold and strong, like, you know, everyone's just not like me, okay, and it's like, but I'm not okay, like, I'm really upset, like, this is an attack on our democracy. And they're pushing through legislation. In the middle of the night, I spent my birthday at Queen's Park, with people who are in pajamas sitting in the gallery to watch it because they were like, this will not go, you know, go through overnight. They were pushing the legislation through overnight. So it's, um, I think it's also really hard. And it's why falling politics is it's hard for me, because this stuff really matters. Like it's it's bigger than it's bigger than me. And most people are so busy. They don't even see all these little, little little details. So I'm still proud that I tried. I'm really proud that our legal challenge continues. But it was really hard to like it was so out of my hands. And it was such an attack. Right? It was such an issue of justice. Clearly, I'm not over it. You can tell me I get so worked up about it.
Unknown Speaker 58:02
Well, how can you be over it? Because it is absolutely 100% wrong way what they did? That was like banana republic kind of crazy. Absolutely. So if I can backtrack a little bit, let's talk Twitter. And what's so weird about the timing that you and I are speaking is that I'm not sure if you're refreshing Twitter, as we speak, to find out who the next president of the United States is going to be. The election was a couple of days ago, and there hasn't yet been a decision made. And I am so curious to get your take on the role of Twitter in our society today, because you were behind the scenes for several years. And you saw the the inner workings. What is your take on Twitter these days?
Unknown Speaker 58:49
Yeah, so I I love Twitter. And similar to working at muchmusic. It was one of those dream jobs where, oh, I love I love this platform. And I also I also know the problems right, like I ran for office and use Twitter, you know, as part of the campaign strategy. So I know what, what women deal with. And I know that there is even more hate and abuse for racialized folks for queer and trans folks, for religious minorities, etc. So coming into Twitter, I was really excited because I have seen how Twitter can change the world from around the Arab Spring to I don't know more to black lives matter. But on the flip side, how it can be used in very dangerous ways. And one of my biggest takeaways and I think what Twitter and the other social media platforms are struggling with, is moving from reactive to proactive because their platforms are being used in ways that they weren't intended to. And as a result, they've been trying to update their policies right. And working with AI is, is make it a better experience for all. And something that should be supporting democracy right, and not being a threat to it. And even like right now with with the US election, you will see that there are notes on certain tweets from Donald Trump, that's very new. That wasn't something they were looking to do. When I was at Twitter in 2016, when he got some people
Unknown Speaker 1:00:32
are saying that it's taken too long for them to do that.
Unknown Speaker 1:00:35
Of course, some people are saying it's taking too long, but then look what he does. So he sees that his tweets are being flagged. So then he goes and does a TV press conference, and then takes the video of the press conference and puts it on Twitter. Right. So this is very much like Marshall McLuhan, you know, the media is the message like how he is, and Trump is excellent at twitter. Trump is excellent at TV. Right. This is this is his background, right apprentice Celebrity Apprentice, like he actually is really good at messaging. I don't like what he's saying this is not an endorsement of Trump. So I think that that's the that's the piece with with Twitter is that there are a lot of people who who leave Twitter because of the hate and abuse. And these are the voices that we need to see on Twitter. Right. Yeah. And that's that that's the part like, ultimately, why I have so much love for Twitter is we've seen so much incredible activism, and stories and reporting come from from Twitter that would have been ignored and has been ignored by mainstream media, right.
Unknown Speaker 1:01:40
And for me, it's community, it's it's built my community of moms from my both my business and my personal life, I it has absolutely changed my life. So when you landed that job, I was super jealous. But I didn't go to Harvard, so they wouldn't have picked me to do that job.
Unknown Speaker 1:01:59
You got to work together while I was at Twitter, and absolutely on the community. I mean, you have done such an incredible job at you know, bringing moms together and think of COVID like I live on my own. So social media that that's that's my Those are my friends, right? That that's the community. And I remember you want sharing a story on a panel at Twitter about how someone it's like, oh, I'm concerned about the mental health of someone you know, and they were able to get a check in like a wellness check. Right? Yeah, I remember that. And like, it's like, wow, that's like a great example of someone signaling for help in the community being like, we hear you, we see you, and we're gonna help you. So I think there's so much more the platforms can be doing, and I'm glad to see some of the progress that has been made since I left Twitter.
Unknown Speaker 1:02:42
I have two more questions for you. The first one is, you scored another incredible job, where you're now the executive director of the walrus magazine, which is one of the most thought provoking publications in Canada. Why are you the right person for that job? Hmm.
Unknown Speaker 1:03:04
So I'm so honored, and especially after everything that happened with City Council, and Bill five, it feels, you know, great to find this role. That I think, you know, when I was hired at both sides, right, both the hiring committee and I felt like, I have this nonlinear resume, right, I've done a lot of different things. And there are definitely a lot of places and a lot of roles where it's like, oh, like we need someone, right with X amount experience in this one field. But to be the executive director of, we actually have a nonprofit model, right. So it's journalism, but it's also events, we have the walrus lab that does Client Services, they needed someone who had some media experience, but also understood policy had done some fundraising had done some partnership work. So I think like, that's why it's such a great fit is I can take my experience from so many, you know, different sectors, and also like a very large and diverse network of people that I've worked with, and tapped into the walrus, which is the same thing, right? This is an organization community that connects across Canada, and we're looking to grow it so I'm very, I'm very thankful. I mean, COVID not an easy year to start a new leadership role. But at the same time, you know, we joke like, Hey, I come with a background in live streaming from from Twitter and very comfortable in this zoom space. So so maybe it's the perfect timing, right?
Unknown Speaker 1:04:30
Okay. You have been asked what it takes to succeed. And you always say hard work, hard work, hard work, which is almost, I think, that I take that for granted in a way. What else Jim, what else do we need in order to succeed or do you need in order to succeed there's got to be more than just hard work.
Unknown Speaker 1:04:55
So live your beliefs, that that is always served me well. Well, and I know that it can be hard for people to show up as their authentic selves, right. And it's definitely easier, you know, for me as, as a white woman with the success that I've had to just show up, right, and, and live my truth. But I, I also have seen the people, you know, around me who've done incredible things is it's them, right? It's, it's, it's it's them, and it's them standing up for and advocating for what they believe so, absolutely, like, work hard. You know, like, stay in touch. It's all about relationships, but live your beliefs, because at the end of the day, like, isn't that what it's about? Like, what did you stand up for? You know, what do you believe in? And I think if you you live that people notice, right people, people really appreciate it.
Unknown Speaker 1:05:49
And the last question, I have been asked who is in the interview me for this series? So I thought it'd be fun for everybody to interview me. So I'm going to grant you one question, Jen, that you would like to ask me.
Unknown Speaker 1:06:05
I love it. It's a bit of a genie wish. I'm going music fan here. When I was growing up my favorite band, and still my favorite band of all time. You get on the block? What? Typically, I was supposed to marry Donnie Wahlberg. So I watched all your interviews. And you had some pretty epic interviews with the new kids and with Donnie especially. So I would just love to know, like, at the height of like, New Kids on the Block being one of the biggest bands in the world, like what was that like interviewing them? But especially Donnie,
Unknown Speaker 1:06:39
hey, you are killing me with this question. This was the exact opposite type of question I expected from you. Also. so shocked that you miss alternative poker with the Beastie Boys are such a big fan of New Kids on the Block. So if I can be very honest with you, I couldn't have given a crap about New Kids on the Block. They meant absolutely nothing to me. I was not a big fan of boy bands, I thought that they were stupid. And I know that I'm probably going to get now hate mail from, you know, all the people back then. But that was not they were just not my thing. I didn't like their music. It was too Poppy. For me. I was like a punk rocker. I was into new wave and alternative music. And like YouTube was my go to band. So when they came in, it was awesome. Because I liked interviewing the the big, you know, it's always great to get the big, most popular bands, because, you know, it's everybody, you know, watches and there's a lot of buzz and excitement. And they were incredibly nice, and really so much fun. And I remember I think it was Donnie who came and sat on my lap and like,
Unknown Speaker 1:07:55
okay, she's with you,
Unknown Speaker 1:07:56
he very flirtatious and that was fun. But as you know, that stuff isn't real. They were just great performers. I was really good in the live situations where they couldn't throw me you know, like they they knew that I was, you know, I could handle the the chaos and the craziness. So the interviews were fun, because I guess there was this playful flirtation, and that is very much, Jen, you mentioned about in our interview, you mentioned a lot about how a lot of the viewers pictured themselves in my role. So there was this mix of every girl in the country hating me and wanting to be me, but also loving me, because I asked the questions that they wanted to hear. They weren't these sort of academic questions. They were more, you know, questions that everybody who was into bands, like, I'm still shocked it would be you wanted to hear?
Unknown Speaker 1:08:56
So isn't one of me, right? Like, it's there is something about boybands that you can just like, fall in love with and escape, right? Like, it's, they're cute, they sing and they dance. And they point to you and say that they love you. I mean, what more can you want is a Twinkie?
Unknown Speaker 1:09:13
That is so hilarious. Thank you so much, Jim, you are you are deep and playful at the same time as serious and silly. And that's to me, what makes an interesting person and it's that sort of friction and dynamic. I think that has served you so well when and all the different roles you've played, where you can bring a sense of authority, but also not take yourself too seriously. You sort of go low and go higher at the same time. And I think that to me is a really exciting definition of success. So thank you so much for your time and for anybody who is interested in being a part of the show. I've set up a phone line where you can call and have your voice heard sort of like, you know, what we did on muchmusic Gen, where you get to be a part of the show. So the number is 833-972-7272, you can call in, you leave me a voice message, you can comment on this show comment on the series of this, you know, reinvention of the vj show. Tell me what you're liking or what you don't like, I'll play your comment on one of the upcoming episodes. If you there's somebody who you really adore from muchmusic, who hasn't yet been interviewed? Tell me who it is. And I'll get them on the show. I want to thank again, Jennifer, so much for being on the show. Oh, I forgot to tell you. If you don't want to call in Listen, I get it. You can also find me on social media. I'm on Twitter all the time. Also LinkedIn or Instagram or Facebook, you could find me and you could leave a message and with a question or a comment about the show, which would be really great. And I'll read it out on the show as well. Jen, I know you have so much else to do today. I know you have other meetings and for those of you who are still listening, thank you so much for being a part of this show. I'll see you next week with another episode reinvention of the vj. You're still living a life filled with music
Unknown Speaker 1:11:19
meaning,
Unknown Speaker 1:11:20
and many reinventions.
Unknown Speaker 1:11:22
Thanks for listening. Follow Erica Ehm reinvention of the vj podcast Subscribe and follow more episodes. Click to reinvention of the vga.com podcast produced in collaboration with Steve Anthony productions, editing and coordination Aflalo Communications Inc. Copyright 2020